Perfectionism is a method of people pleasing because you are thinking, “I need to be flawless in order to be loved, accepted, or appeased.” There’s a nuance in people pleasing too that I don’t think gets discussed enough, which is that it is a self-preservation mechanism, which can very much come into play in the workplace. I’d love to share that with you too, if you’re interested.

People-pleasing has a very real place in our world, especially in the workplace. Share on X

Let’s talk about that. First of all, I think the way you explained that chronic people pleasing is important because you’re right, when I think of people pleasing, it’s like, “I’m a total people pleaser.” I’m going to say that from the time that I was little, I never wanted to get in trouble. I had two older sisters and I always saw them getting in trouble. I’m like, “Heck, no. I’m not getting in trouble.”

I’m what I call a rule follower because that’s where I’m comfortable. Those are my boundaries. If someone tells me not to do something, I’m not going to do it but I think the important piece for me there was at the cost of my wants and my needs. I think that’s the bigger difference because I don’t care if I people please for something that’s irrelevant to me but when it comes at our cost, that’s where you pay the price for people pleasing.

If you think about the type of people that we typically want to attract into our world, we would often say, and I would assume you would say, “I want to attract people who are authentic, who are transparent, and who value honesty and integrity.” If you’ve ever had even a friend in your life where you’ve said, “Do you want to go do this,” or, “Should we make these type of plans,” and they go, “Yeah. Sure. That’s fine.” You’re like, “Do you have a different opinion?” They’re like, “No. That’s fine.” You’re like, “I don’t know if you’re being honest or not.”

When we talk about who we want to attract into our world, we’re not going, “I want a bunch of liars.” I think it’s important for us to understand that we also have to be the person we want to attract. Whether that is subordinates, coworkers, people that we are in collaboration with, intimate partners, or our family. We want people in our world who are authentic. When you are around somebody who you know will be clear and kind with you, you feel so much safer and that’s incredibly important in leadership roles for your subordinates and your coparts to know that they are safe with you, that you will kindly and authentically express what’s true for you.

Self-Preservation Through People-Pleasing

Let’s talk about that self-preservation. With human beings, there’s that old adage, the fight and flight from where the dinosaur era and all that stuff. We want to always try to be safe. That’s the first thing that we want in our world. Be safe, have basic needs met, and that whole thing. How do we do that self-preservation by people pleasing?

I’m glad that you brought up the fight, flight, and freeze because there’s a newer one that’s been in the psychological community discussion around fawning in order to stay safe. If we look at primitive humans and what we would do in the face of impending threat or danger, we would fight, flee, freeze, or potentially fawn. If we’re looking at that from a primitive standpoint, let’s say we’re about to be attacked by a mountain lion. To fawn in the face of that sort of a threat would be to maybe try to find some other meat and go, “Here’s some meat, kitty, kitty. Go over there. Go grab that meat.”

It’s a different way of addressing some threats. Now, all of those primitive fear responses have modern iterations and the modern iteration of fawning is people-pleasing. I’m sure that many of you can relate to this. Anybody who is a woman or is fem-presenting or has been socialized as a woman knows exactly what that’s like to placate a man in order to stay safe so that we don’t get murdered, followed to our car, or something put in our drink.

I think also many people reading can relate to having maybe a volatile caregiver or somebody who took care of you as you grew up where you learned that walking on eggshells, being quiet, or taking care of them, making sure that they’re always okay allowed you to fly under the radar. We cannot negate the fact that people pleasing has a very real place in our world and one of the ways that that shows up the most prevalently for us is in the workplace because oftentimes we do have to twist ourselves or contort in some way to keep our livelihood to make sure that we can put food on the table.

There’s a delineation here and the delineation is, “Am I searching for this approval out of self-care, out of self-preservation?” It means I need this promotion, I need this job, I need this stability or am I searching for this approval to outsource my self-worth? Meaning I need this person to love me. I need this person to approve of me in order to feel valid as a human, in order to believe that I am worthy, or I am enough.

Those are two very different motivations. That becomes the question or the inquiry when you notice like, “I am shape-shifting or placating to this individual. Am I doing that from a place of self-preservation or am I outsourcing my self-worth?” Sometimes it’s a little medley of both and that’s where it can get a little trickier.

Outsourcing Self-Worth

Tell me more, a little bit about outsourcing your self-worth because obviously, we’re talking to women in the corporate space who are trying to advance in their careers. By the way, Jamie Kern Lima just released her book called Worthy. She does a fabulous job at differentiating self-worth versus self-confidence. She says that self-worth is the foundation of the house, which is in the earth, and then self-confidence is the external house that’s on top of the foundation. I think that’s a good way of looking at your self-worth but tell me more about outsourcing your self-worth. What does that look like?

This might be trying to do an extra great job, not because that’s of importance to you, but more so because of what that will look like if somebody doesn’t think you checked all the boxes appropriately or if you haven’t gone over and above what that might say or mean about you. However, one of the things that I have seen very consistently with folks who work in corporate is they will oftentimes have a manager or a boss or somebody above them who is emblematic of someone else in their life. Usually a father, a mother, or maybe a past ex-partner who maybe demands that you prove yourself in order to be loved and accepted. Sometimes we’ll look at that person that we are working for and we’ll go, “This looks a lot like how I had to have perfect grades for Dad.”

Amy, I’m going to have to stop you right there. Here is my deal. This is so funny. When I was a kid, my dad did this too. I’m one of five siblings and my dad, looking back, I think he thought he was trying to motivate us when he did this. If I came home, I remember this day specifically. It was fourth grade. I was living in Mexico City at the time. I’m 100% Mexican so we were living in Mexico at the time.

In Mexico, the grades are 5 through 10 with 9 and 10 being an A. I came home and I got a 9+. My dad’s like, “Why didn’t you get a 10?” On the next report card, I come home and I get a 10. He’s like, “Why didn’t you get a 10+?” This was a story of all of us, including my children. He still does this to this day and it’s so funny because when I got my first job, I’m like, “Dad, I got a job.” “Did you ask for a raise?” If I got a raise, “Did you ask for more?” It was like that our whole lives.

In his head, I know that he was trying to motivate us, but what ended up happening is exactly what you described because I am an extremely driven and motivated person. Especially when I was a kid, I didn’t want to get in trouble and I never equated the, “I need to be loved so I need to be liked.” That totally brought up memories when I was a kid.

I don’t mean to make light of this, but you’re not alone. That is not uncommon that we will so frequently look to new relationships that look somewhat similar to ones that we’ve had in the past as a do-over as an opportunity to get it right this time. If I didn’t get that 10+ for Dad, maybe now I can get it for the CEO that I work for. We don’t necessarily consciously realize that. We think that we are just overachievers or perfectionists. We put all of these seemingly noble monikers on it when what we’re doing is trying to heal past wounds through a new relationship and that’s not always a bad thing.

However, I think what we have to recognize is that our self-worth stands outside of any approval or criticism. It’s funny that you bring up Jamie’s book because I too have a house analogy that I’ve used for many years and it’s this concept around if you think about yourself as a house, and we all have these intricate different rooms. Some that we would not want anybody else to see, and then some that we show to everybody else but the house stands alone. It has its own worth.

On the proverbial porch of our house, we will have people who come along and drop giant piles of crap onto our porch. That is like getting passed over for the promotion and that’s being told, “No, we don’t need anyone right now.” That’s being told, “I want a divorce. I don’t love you any longer.” It is an uncomfortable emotion that we feel on the spectrum of human feelings.

Now conversely, we will also have people who drop off gorgeous gifts on our porch. Those are things like honors, accolades, commendations, compliments, and love but both of those things do not change the worth of the house. They just change your experience. I always like to say I’m not currently accepting any piles of s*** into my house. Even though it would stink everything up, it’s not necessarily going to change the worth, but it’s going to change the experience. The same is true for people leaving gifts. If you give me a compliment, does that make me feel good? That doesn’t mean, “Now, I’m imbued with worthiness.”

It just simply means that I’m experiencing something that feels good on the spectrum of human emotion but far more often than not, we take what we feel and we make that mean something about who we are. If we get passed over for the promotion and that hurts, instead of allowing ourselves to go through a grief process, we take how that feels and then we make that mean, “I must not be good enough.” We make this grandiose assessment about who we are. “Forever and always, Amy is not enough, not worthy,” instead of, “This situation sucks. I don’t suck.”

You’re speaking my language. I love everything that you just said. I went through Landmark Education and I did this back in 2007. That’s where my personal development started because I was going through a bad divorce at the time and you’re right. Before Landmark Education, I would get a letter from my lawyer and I would be scared, afraid, and cry with this divorce and whatever. Landmark Education is four days of very intense reflection work and self-work. We put meaning on so many things that are meaningless.

After landmark, and I’d get a letter from the lawyer, I’m like, “It’s just a piece of paper with words on it.” I’d be like, “No big deal.” It’s not that I didn’t feel the emotions, but I was able to feel them, release them, and then reground myself, and then move forward. I think that’s exactly what you were talking about. That’s huge in the corporate world because yes, if you get passed up for a promotion or if you get some negative feedback or whatever, then take that information, and feel the feelings that you’re feeling because you’re human.

You have emotions. You can’t control your emotions. Feel them and then the next day, figure out what your next game plan is, whether for constructive criticism. Take whatever you can and apply it to your work so that you can improve and get better or what can you do for that promotion that you didn’t get or things like that? I absolutely love everything that you just said.

Moving Forward

In that vein, I want to shift a little bit to finding your voice because everything that we spoke about is symptoms of a root cause like those childhood wounds that you were talking about. In Landmark, they always say that we’re bodies of adults, but souls and minds of a five-year-old. It’s because you know those wounds that happened to you when you were five, you are living into them still if you don’t recognize them, heal them, and all that good stuff. When you are going through something like, “I didn’t get the promotion and now I’m at work.” Now, I have to figure out how to reposition myself, speak up for myself, and find my voice. I’m feeling all this self-preservation. How do you move forward from there?

One thing that I think warrants underlining here is that a lot of times there is truth to the idea of the squeaky wheel getting the oil, this old idiom because we are in such a fast-paced, really untenable way in which a lot of corporations operate. Fortunately, I think people are starting to reimagine and re-engineer that but we’re in such a fast-paced hustle culture that most people are thinking about. This your leadership and your bosses included, are focusing on, “Have we checked that box? Did we get this done? Did we do that this?”

Unless it’s on their task list to recognize things that I may not normally see every single day, unless that’s on their task list, you’re going to get missed. We have to be vocal about what’s going on with us. I think it’s important to recognize that it’s not always coming from malicious intent. People aren’t always going, “I’m going to deliberately not acknowledge anything that Rosie’s doing so that she feels like crap.” It’s usually that they’re just caught up in their own agenda and their own levels of criterion that they need to handle.

I think taking a little bit of that personal aspect out of it and going, “No. I have to go to bat for my cause and I might be the only voice capable of honoring what I’ve got going on.” It might not be my supervisor who speaks up. It might not be my co-part who says, “Check out what Amy did.” I might be the only voice depending on your specific scenario. One thing that I think is important is to use your emotions as points because most of the time, that will be the entry point.

We’ll be either frustrated, overwhelmed, angry, or resentful, and all of those emotions are there as messaging. They’re there to say, “Pay attention. Something has gone awry. We need you to understand what the problem is so that we can move towards more comfortable emotions,” but far more often than not, when we’re resentful, we just want to stay in a place of, “Why our boss sucks,” or, “Why the system sucks,” or whatever is not working right.

If only that would change, then everything would be fine. Instead of going, “This resentment is indicating to me that I’m not feeling acknowledged and I’m not feeling like I’m being seen for the effort that I’m putting forth,” or, “I’m being pulled in too many directions,” or, “I’m being micromanaged,” or whatever it happens to be.

When you nail down where that emotion is coming from, then you are better suited to advocate for yourself. We then get into the whole concept of, “How do we broach difficult conversations in order to be heard the most effectively?” There’s an entire science to that but part of that is, in my opinion, I think one of the best ways to go about that is to get conversation consent. That can start a conversation that could be quite tenuous or precarious off on a much better foot.

In psychology, they oftentimes will call it a soft startup where instead of saying, “We need to talk,” or, “I need to put myself on your calendar,” or, “We need to book some time out,” is to say something more soft like, “There’s some stuff I’d love to share with you. Is there any chance that we could get this on the calendar in the next couple of days?” What you’re doing with that invitation is you’re saying, “I respect your time and energy,” and that already puts a beginning marker that will set you up for success so much more smoothly.

I like that approach. However, I was thinking, would men do that same approach?

This is interesting. I used to work in cosmetics and we would talk about connecting with people who are different than you. We would call it style stepping. It is this way in which you acknowledge and mirror what is being presented to you. If somebody is coming at you with a little bit more of an abrasive tone or edge, you can mirror that with the same level of strength.

You don’t have to be sassy, acrimonious, rude, or biting, but the same level of intensity or energy. For example, if somebody’s coming at me and saying like, “Amy, I needed these on my desk by 2:00.” I say, “Yes. Absolutely. I understand that was the case and due to this, that, and the other, that’s not going to be possible.” I am showing up at the same level of intensity and I’m mirroring that authority, but I’m not being rude or I’m not saying, “Screw off. I’m not going to do it.”

It’s using that same level of authority right back at that person. Again, that depends on your company dynamic because, in some situations, they pretend that’s applauded and it’s not. Also, we also have to keep in mind, are you searching for approval because you have to have this job? Are you being motivated from a place of self-preservation or is it, “I am needing their approval because I don’t feel valuable as a human?”

There’s some stuff to work out in, in that case, but I do think far more often than not, especially folks who are a little bit more aggressive in their approach, they tend to respect folks more who mirror that back to them. If you cower, if you get more like, “Yes. Absolutely.” They tend to be like, “There is no backbone on that one.” However, even holding your body up with that assertiveness and that confidence can show that you are not going to back down in those situations.

Here’s the other thing too. The way that men have been doing things hasn’t been working. Using them as a barometer of what we should be doing is not necessarily going to get us very far. I personally feel that there are a lot more things we can embody in order to pave the way for what strong leadership looks like. I have a really difficult time with the words masculine and feminine because I feel like they over-genderize the stuff that doesn’t need to be gendered like emotion. Emotion does not have a gender.

Emotion does not have a gender. Share on X

I prefer strength and softness. Sometimes strength is being called for. Sometimes softness is being called for whether or not you are male, female, non-binary, etc. I think if we can recognize, “Yes, there are going to be many times when strength is the tool necessary, but there’s also going to be the softness that’s being called for that can move the needle far more than if I only resided in a place of strength.

I appreciate you pointing that out as far as how men behave isn’t necessarily a barometer, but there are some men who are soft, kind, and still firm. I’ve always admired those men who are allies to women and who support women’s advancement and empowerment, yet they still have this firm leadership and yet they’re soft and kind because you don’t have to be a jerk when you’re trying to lead a team.

I think that’s where men sometimes get in trouble and they don’t recognize that the people that work for them are human beings with emotions. Sometimes they just forget. You mentioned this. When you’re a manager, you have your own stuff. You have your own work. You have your own results that you have to perform and you still have this team that is reporting to you. You still have to act as their professional development counselor, their manager, and try to be there for them. There’s just so much there.

That’s why I always like to say, that when you’re an employee, an individual contributor, you need to take on your career as you are the pilot of that plane. You are the one that’s driving your career. You can’t let your career be in the hands of your manager because they’re busy. As you said, it’s not that they’re intentionally trying to ignore you, they’re busy. They’re not thinking about you.

Finding The Right Words

As human beings, we’re so worried about what everybody else says about us, but they’re not worried about us. They’re worried about themselves. That’s so funny. That’s a good point. We’re talking about finding the right words. For me, when I’m trying to help someone in an interview, for example, I always say, “You need to craft your script.” You need to have your story vault.

You need to make sure that you know exactly what you’re going to say in response to different things. However, in the day-to-day when you’re not thinking about that conversation that you need to have with your manager in a preparation-type format, that’s when I think you need to pause and find the right words. How would you suggest finding the right words?

I’m going to give them to you. This is such a great example because you’re right. If you know you have a conversation on the books, you can prepare, but if somebody catches you off guard, “What are we going to say?” We go into our autopilot and usually, that is fueled by our defense mechanisms, which are to get aggressive, to run away, to freeze, or to placate.

Having a sort of arsenal of scripts or statements that you can use when you’re caught off guard can be incredibly advantageous. Saying something very simple like, “I was not expecting you to say that,” or, “I need a little time to wrap my head around that.” Just even saying wow can give you a few seconds to go, “I’d love a little time to stew on that,” or, “Can I chew on that for a minute,” or, “I’m taken aback by that or I’m taken off guard.”

You can say what’s there, but pick one of those and rehearse it. You have to get in front of the mirror and rehearse it over and over and over again like, “Wow. I’m taken off guard by that.” “Wow. You surprised me with that.” “Hmm. I need to chew on that.” Say it over and over. Just pick one. I think of those bridge statements that are helping you bridge the gap so that you can get to that place where you can process a little bit better to figure out what you think.

Think about if the situation was reversed. If I’m bringing something to you, Rosie, I want you to have the expanse of being able to chew on it, to look at it from different angles, and to not just react as opposed to respond. If you are approached in that way and then you say, “You know what, I’d love to give that some good consideration. Can we circle back in even fifteen minutes,” or, “Let me just run to the bathroom real quick and then I’ll be right back ready.”

Even that short little burst of time can help you formulate a little bit more of what you might want to say about whatever’s on deck because if we don’t, we tend to go into what’s commonly referred to as being the yes, man or I’m from California and we would sometimes call it being the totally girl like, “Totally. Yeah, I can do that. Yeah, totally.” This, by the way, goes for any time that you tend to say yes to things without contemplation. This can even be in your personal life.

If someone’s asking, “Can you watch our dogs while we’re on vacation,” or, “Can you bake some cupcakes for your kid’s school?” If they’re coming at you right away and you don’t have time to think, one of the best things that you can say in those situations is, “How soon do you need an answer? I would hate to not be able to come through for you so I want to make sure that I have a very committed yes. How soon do you need an answer?” Having some stock phrases to help you with those.

I love those two. I think the one that resonates would be if someone surprises me with something, “Wow. I didn’t expect that,” because it’s exactly what I’m thinking and it gives you that couple of seconds to figure out, “What am I going to do?” I love the, “Let me go to the bathroom, come back,” and then you have 2 or 3 minutes to figure out what the next best thing to do is.

Creating Boundaries

Also, along those lines, that’s where you start creating those boundaries. You can even come back from the bathroom and say, “I need more time to figure this out. Let’s meet in an hour or tomorrow or whenever.” Creating those boundaries is important. I know a lot of people talk about boundaries, but when you talk about creating boundaries, where do you think people can start especially if they’re people pleasers and they say yes to everything?

I knew a person in the corporate world that was good at their job and because they were good, the leadership team kept asking them to do more and more work. They were like, “Yes, yes, yes,” until they were at a point where they were like, “I can’t do anymore. I’m getting penalized because I’m good at my job.” Let’s talk about boundaries.

That’s so awesome that you brought that up because I call that being penalized for being excellent. Part of it is how we speak up. In fact, I had a situation with a client and she’s given me permission to share this where she was vocal, but the way she was vocal did not allow her to be heard. She’s very gregarious. She’s very outspoken. She has a lot of camaraderie with the people that she works with. She works in a medical institution.

She would be jokey and somewhat passive-aggressive like, “Sure. Just give it to me. I’ll take care of all of it.” She was speaking up, but she was doing so in a way where she could easily be dismissed. If you think about it, the rationale on the opposite side is very common, “I’m sure if it was that serious, she would tell me. I’m sure if Rosie couldn’t handle it, I’m sure Amy would speak up,” but she’s making a joke about it. It’s so easy. It’s not ill-intended. It just makes logical sense that if it was that big of a deal, they would tell me.

Also what oftentimes will happen is if you are excellent, which I know everyone listening is the other party will make up two truths. Either one you like doing it, that you prefer to do it your way and that you are controlling. This happens a lot in marriages too, by the way, and the other one is that it’s easy for you. It’s because you don’t speak up about the sheer volume of labor or time that’s involved, that it’s just easy that Rosie just magically makes it happen. Unless you say, “First of all, A) I don’t like it that much, and B) It’s not that easy for me,” or, “Here are the ramifications, the implications of that request.” They’re just thinking that you’re this miracle worker.

That can be an incredible lead-in to say something like, “I do pride myself on making it look easy, but I want to express to you sort of the impact that these responsibilities are having on me.” Instead of saying, “You are doing this. You don’t respect me,” but to come at it, I don’t think I’ve expressed to you how things are landing on my side and how would you ever know?

That is unbelievably unfair to you. If I’m harboring resentment about my workload and you have no idea, that’s not giving you any respect to be able to rectify it. I want to share with you exactly what’s transpiring on my end. I’m hoping that we can figure this out in order to improve productivity, secure the bottom line, and do something related to their corporate values. Bring it back to something that’s of merit to the actual company.

It’s because when you say, “I’m bringing this up in service of less turnaround, higher ROI, checking off KPIs. If you’re bringing up stuff like that, they’re way more likely to listen instead of, “This is Suzy from accounting bitching and moaning about workload. I think you asked me like, where do we start with this? I’m going to circle right back to that emotion that we were talking about. Typically, we are being vocal to the wrong person.

If you’re pissed about your workload, it’s likely that your partner, your spouse has gotten an earful. Your best friend knows exactly what’s up and probably your therapist but if it’s worth complaining about, it’s probably worth talking to the person who could rectify the grievance. One of your entry points is what are the things or whom am I chronically complaining about that I haven’t taken any action on?

If it's worth complaining about, it's probably worth talking to the person who could actually rectify the grievance. Share on X

I’m not talking about blowing off steam, just venting, or releasing a tough day. I’m talking about a habitual pattern of complaint. A pattern of behavior where you come home and you bitch and moan about this project that you’re on or whatever, but you have not been vocal in a way in which you can be heard in order to rectify or advocate for that situation.

For this particular client that I was sharing with you, I said, “I think we need to re-engineer this approach. I think you need to go in and have a conversation with your superior. I think you need to lead with vulnerability.” This is something that is terrifying and again, in the very patriarchal corporate world in which we live, has been frowned upon. However, we know that based on our limbic system and how we respond to emotion, humans make decisions based on emotion almost always.

It leads us because we want to feel a specific way. We buy this thing so we can feel freedom or we can feel expansiveness or whatever. However, we have to understand that leading with vulnerability does not mean bawling our eyes out or sharing our deepest fears. It just means stating what’s true for us without all of this facade and guard up. She went into this conversation and she said, “I think that as I’ve approached some of these situations that we’ve been trying to work on, I have done you a disservice by not expressing just how unbelievably important this is to me.”

Her cadence and her delivery were so starkly opposite from how she had approached things in the past. This was a few months ago and the superiors completely changed. They have reworked the ways that they’re communicating and it all had to do with her going in with a sense of vulnerability, sharing what’s true and what’s real for her. She didn’t bawl her eyes out. Vulnerability doesn’t have to look a specific way. It’s honestly just expressing what’s true for you emotionally. It can work wonders.

Also, the other party, this is the great piece about that, feels so much safer with you because they know exactly what’s real. They know what’s going on. It’s going back to that authenticity piece of like, “I know what’s happening with this person. Now, I can course correct and help accommodate because they’re not just blowing smoke up my ass.” It’s leading with some vulnerability.

Amy’s Journey

Amy, I love everything that we talked about. I could talk to you for hours. This is all so cool. I want to shift the conversation a little bit to you. How did you become a certified life coach and hypnotherapist? You’re very eloquent. You’re very experienced in those key phrases that people can say. Tell me a little bit about your story. How did your career start off and then how did you transition into becoming a certified life coach?

It’s interesting. I got my corporate chops in the cosmetic world. I had pretty much a big girl job when I was in my early twenties. I was a corporate trainer for a prestige makeup brand. I had the company car and the assistant. We were traveling and doing all of this awesome fancy stuff. This was in the early to mid-2000s. I was driving home from one of my locations in this stupid company car that was the Golden Handcuffs.

I was listening to Kelly Clarkson’s Breakaway and it dawned on me in that moment that I had not given myself permission to enjoy just basic human things like music because I was on the phone doing business during my commutes every single day. I didn’t even listen to music anymore. It was this epiphany while I was screaming singing “Breakaway. I’ll spread my wings.” I get back home to my house and I’ve got false lashes sliding down my face. I looked like the Joker.

My husband goes, “What happened? Are you okay?” I held my fingers up and I said, “I am this close to completely losing who I am, completely losing myself.” I realized that in all of that ambition, in my love for creativity and the arts, I was making decisions that were not catered to my ultimate fulfillment. My relationship with my partner wasn’t stronger. I was missing all the key events for the people in my life. My relationships weren’t closer.

I didn’t have much of a social life to speak of. I had become this job. I remember thinking at the time in my early twenties, “If I’m working myself to the bone like this, I want it to be for my vision, for my dream, not for somebody else’s.” I don’t want to be on spreadsheets about lipsticks at 11:30 at night. This is not what 80-year-old Amy is going to say, “Yeah. I’m so glad you were doing that.” Coincidentally at the time, my partner knew that I wanted to shift and he heard a life coach on the radio. He said, “I heard about this job. It’s exactly what you do. It’s been what you’ve been doing since you were little. You need to check it out.”

He was so convicted about it that he sent away materials and brochures for this particular coaching establishment. That’s the impetus behind all of it. I ended up getting certified. There were a lot of ups and downs in between there. In 2019, I ended up doing a very comprehensive hypnosis certification that spanned about two years, and have just been a connoisseur of additional modalities throughout that time period.

However, a lot of the vocal speaking-up stuff came from my personal life, and I’ll spare you the gory details, but I grew up in a very conservative highly dogmatic religious community where there was a lot of that notion that you were talking about it being the good girl and not getting in trouble. Don’t rock the boat. We have all these idioms for it. Don’t open up a can of worms or sweep it under the rug. They’re always to say, “Just fall in line. Shut up and be quiet.”

A lot of my personal coming of age into my own voice was separating from my parents and my mom specifically and saying, “I don’t subscribe to the faith traditions that I was raised with.” That became the catalyst to helping me find the vernacular, the words, the semantics because I’ll tell you what, at the beginning, I was incredibly adversarial and combative. I was full on in my fight response and I wanted to fight about everything.

It wasn’t until many times of walking back my delivery that I remember telling my mom, “I still feel very strongly about what we conversed about, but I should have never said it to you in that way, and for that, I’m sorry. You don’t deserve that.” That’s when I realized you can give voice to things. You can ask an adult child to move out of the house. You can end a business partnership. You can ask for a divorce, and you can do those conversations with poise, grace, and kindness. That has influenced the modality and work that I do now.

Takeaways

I love this conversation. This is probably one of my favorites, Amy. It hits home to the actual essence of a human being. It’s not even talking about careers at this point. It’s talking about the humans themselves and how to deal with your emotions, and then how to be able to communicate what you’re feeling in a very eloquent way. I love this conversation. Amy, if you were to leave our readers with one takeaway point, what would that be?

For most folks reading, I want to underline again the question, “What do I chronically complain about? Whom do I chronically complain about?” Also, checking yourself around, “Is that a grievance that I’ve given them the opportunity to clean up?” I love to say you need to at least give people the opportunity to be what you need. If they have no idea that it’s what’s going on with you, that’s on you or if they have an idea, but you’ve been passive-aggressive, you’ve joked about it, that doesn’t count.

You have to give people an opportunity to be what you need to take an inventory of those things that you’ve been chronically complaining about. The other is to check in on your modus operandi of people-pleasing. What is that motivation? Am I doing this because I genuinely need this job, I need this promotion, I need this raise or am I doing this because this boss looks a lot like my mom and this is feeling like I need to get an A+ or a 10+? Am I outsourcing my self-worth in this manner?” It’s because when you get crystal clear about that, your actions become a lot more clear, and then you get to decide, “What’s the most powerful way for me to address this.” Those are the two questions that I would encourage you to lean on for discovery.

Amy, thank you so much for your time. This has been an absolutely lovely conversation.

I had a blast, Rosie. Thanks so much.

—

I promised you a powerhouse at the beginning of this episode, and I delivered with my conversation with Amy. I am taking some key components from the conversation that I had with Amy. The first one is the people-pleasing definition. I think this is so critically important to understand. Amy highlighted that people-pleasing isn’t just about being overly nice. It’s about putting others’ needs ahead of your own at a personal cost and that was a key thought for me.

The fact that we’re putting others’ needs above our own is a habit that can sneak into your professional life often without you even realizing it, especially in those high-pressure environments. One of the things that I appreciated about Amy is that she was giving us some powerful phrases that we can utilize in our day-to-day. For example, someone at work came up to you and asked you a question that came out of left field and you were surprised about it. You can always say, “Wow. You just surprised me with that. Let me think about it,” and then take 2 or 3 seconds to regroup and figure out how you’re going to proceed from there.

However, the powerful phrases that she provided us were phenomenal. The second thing that was pretty enlightening for me was the self-preservation mechanism. Amy explained that people-pleasing is often a form of self-preservation. It is a way to stay safe in both personal and professional settings. It’s important to distinguish when you’re acting out of genuine self-care versus when you’re outsourcing your self-worth. It means that once again, you’re putting others’ needs above your own when it doesn’t serve you at all. I think that self-preservation is also key.

The third thing is finding your voice. We talked about the importance of speaking up for yourself at work, whether it’s just asking for what you need or setting boundaries. Your voice is the most powerful and important tool in advocating for your career. One of the things that I’m constantly talking to my clients about is being prepared. The more you’re prepared, the more you gain that confidence to advocate for yourself. The same thing when you’re thinking about having a conversation with your manager about whatever, you need to sit down and think about the words that you’re going to be using.

I call that crafting your script so that you are prepared and ready to talk to your manager. The more you prepare for your career, the more confidence you gain over time. Amy left us with one actionable tip. She encourages us to do an inventory of what or who we chronically complain about. Ask yourself if you’ve allowed that person to meet your needs or address the issue. If not, it is time to have that conversation with honesty and vulnerability. I thought that was key because you complained to your husband, your spouse, or your partner’s spouse, best friend, or family member, but you never go to the root cause.

Now that you’ve absorbed all of these powerful insights, it is time to put them into action. One of the things that I would love for you to do is start by taking the Promotion Readiness Quiz. This is for you to see how ready you are for that next big step in your career. The quiz will give you a clear picture of where you stand and what you can do to move forward to advance in your profession.

If you haven’t done so already, check out the Unlock the Leader Within Membership. This community is most definitely designed for women like you who are ready to overcome corporate challenges and step into leadership roles with confidence. One of my objectives is very simple but powerful to help you build unshakeable confidence. Again, preparation begets confidence, master the art of self-promotion, and create a clear roadmap for your career advancement. With that, thank you for hanging out with me and Amy. Remember to be brave, be bold, and take action.

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About Amy Green Smith

Amy Green Smith is a certified and credentialed women’s leadership coach and hypnotherapist, masterful speaker, and personal empowerment expert. Amy uses her roles as coach, writer, podcaster, and speaker to move individuals beyond limiting beliefs and sabotaging mindsets to a place of radical personal empowerment and self-worth. With acute focus on helping people “find their voice”, Amy uses her popular weekly podcast, The Bold-Faced Truth, to address issues of worthiness, self-confidence, and letting go of people-pleasing to assist listeners in creating and living radically joyful lives. Amy has been instrumental in aiding thousands of high-achieving women to step into their authentic power and craft the life they desire. She is highly sought after for her uncommon style of irreverence, wisdom, and humor and has been a featured expert in over 100+ media outlets including Inspired Coach Magazine and on Fox 5 San Diego. Start stalking Amy at www.AmyGreenSmith.com and grab a free copy of her eWorkbook/Audiobook, Stand Up for Yourself Without Being a Dick: 9 Proven Challenges to Radically Improve Your Self-Confidence and Self-Worth.